Monday, December 19, 2005
Discipline
In my lifetime I’ve only witnessed the exercise of withdrawing fellowship once, I think. The one incident I’m thinking of consisted of the elders reading a letter from an individual who was involved in an affair with a deacon’s wife. He did not admit anything in the letter other than stating that he was withdrawing as one of the church’s "corporation officers" and that he would no longer be attending our church. A few months later the elders began (and even today) to speak as if they had withdrawn fellowship from this brother. As I remember the letter it sounded like the brother had withdrawn from us.
I now find it ironic that I now sit in the (for Randy) "shepherd’s chair." To add to the irony factor I now find myself wondering about a sinning brother at our church and the element of church (Matthew 18 and I Corinthians 5) discipline.
This brother ("SB" – sinning brother) showed up at our children’s Christmas Party yesterday with ex-wife in tow. Some troubling aspects:
1. SB is married to another woman now.
2. SB and current wife are separated due to SB sleeping with ex-wife.
3. SB came forward recently, admitting his sin, and asking for forgiveness.
4. We've prayed with and counseled SB to break off affair with ex and to try and make things right with current wife.
5. SB and "ex" have moved in together.
6. SB and ex showed up at our church’s Children’s Christmas Party yesterday.
7. I found myself talking with ex and trying to be friendly to her.
My question or questions –
1. Has anyone out there witnessed a church taking the steps outlined in Matt.18 and I Cor. 5? How was it done? How long did it take the church to go through all of the steps? Was it done in love?
2. If anyone answers in the affirmative to #1, did it end up bringing back their SB?
I now find it ironic that I now sit in the (for Randy) "shepherd’s chair." To add to the irony factor I now find myself wondering about a sinning brother at our church and the element of church (Matthew 18 and I Corinthians 5) discipline.
This brother ("SB" – sinning brother) showed up at our children’s Christmas Party yesterday with ex-wife in tow. Some troubling aspects:
1. SB is married to another woman now.
2. SB and current wife are separated due to SB sleeping with ex-wife.
3. SB came forward recently, admitting his sin, and asking for forgiveness.
4. We've prayed with and counseled SB to break off affair with ex and to try and make things right with current wife.
5. SB and "ex" have moved in together.
6. SB and ex showed up at our church’s Children’s Christmas Party yesterday.
7. I found myself talking with ex and trying to be friendly to her.
My question or questions –
1. Has anyone out there witnessed a church taking the steps outlined in Matt.18 and I Cor. 5? How was it done? How long did it take the church to go through all of the steps? Was it done in love?
2. If anyone answers in the affirmative to #1, did it end up bringing back their SB?
Comments:
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Not bad Greg although I believe your formula is somewhat "irrational."
I think Larry is dead on with his read on Matt. 18.
All this thinking has me getting gray wiskr.
I think Larry is dead on with his read on Matt. 18.
All this thinking has me getting gray wiskr.
I've got nothing on this one, my friend. I struggle with the whole concept.
There was a brief time, shortly after my divorce, that my ex was unwilling to admit guilt/ask for prayers/confess sin...all that jazz. Under the precepts of many a church I know, she could very well have been sent packing. She was given time though, and now she, her 10-year-old son, and her newly baptized husband are integral parts of our church family.
For what it's worth.
There was a brief time, shortly after my divorce, that my ex was unwilling to admit guilt/ask for prayers/confess sin...all that jazz. Under the precepts of many a church I know, she could very well have been sent packing. She was given time though, and now she, her 10-year-old son, and her newly baptized husband are integral parts of our church family.
For what it's worth.
I can remember as a child sitting in the pew while something I didn't understand was happening...I only knew it felt bad, I didn't know exactly what was going on.
I don't know of a time when I have seen anything productive come of it as far as the people eventually being restored to Christ and the body...
I will be praying for you and the other Elders as you make that decision.
I don't know of a time when I have seen anything productive come of it as far as the people eventually being restored to Christ and the body...
I will be praying for you and the other Elders as you make that decision.
Thanks for your input everyone. In my mind I know Jesus is far more patient with us than we are with each other. I’m no where close to “pulling the trigger” on this sort of action. Keep Jeff and me in your prayers as we seek wisdom and guidance in this area.
Steve – What a testament to the Lord, you, and to the College Church with respect to being able to worship with your ex-wife at the same church.
Steve – What a testament to the Lord, you, and to the College Church with respect to being able to worship with your ex-wife at the same church.
I have seen this done incorrectly and have tried to apply it correctly in a congregation. Before I became a Christian I saw it while visiting a church - the reason was non-attendance. Have to admit that it seemed to me that the people had withdrawn from the church - not the other way around.
Here in Maastricht we went to a brother who was struggling with fidelity. Our efforts (loving concern, shown in action, counseling etc) helped at first, but in the end the SB decided to leave. Pain all around. The first saction went on for three years in total (from start to when SB left again).
Have to agree that it gets much more complicated when family is involved (people YOU know instead of "just" an SB or SS). Patience and love are extremely important.
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Here in Maastricht we went to a brother who was struggling with fidelity. Our efforts (loving concern, shown in action, counseling etc) helped at first, but in the end the SB decided to leave. Pain all around. The first saction went on for three years in total (from start to when SB left again).
Have to agree that it gets much more complicated when family is involved (people YOU know instead of "just" an SB or SS). Patience and love are extremely important.
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